tv FOX News Sunday With Chris Wallace FOX News December 15, 2013 11:00am-12:01pm PST
him shannon bream. thank you for watching fox where more news is always on the way. i'm chris wallace. another school shooting. sandy hook elementary marks one year since a gunman killed 26. >> the students -- the student that entered the high school had a shotgun and he made no effort to hide. it. >> they look for a motive as a student opens fire at a suburban denver high school. and on the other side of the country, new town marks a sad anniversary. >> it is another day without my older sister by my side. >> we will talk with carly whose sister vicky gave her life while shielding her first graders from the shooter. >> and with so little action after the national outrage we
will sit down with key figures on both sides of the gun do beat. gun debate. mark kelly and larry pratt who heads gun owners of america. and then the house passes a bipartisan budget deal. as lawmakers on capitol hill try to avoid another government shutdown. >> in a divided government, you don't get everything you want. >> while passage is likely, the plan deepens the divide inside the gop. with speaker boehner slamming outside conservative groups. >> i think they are pushing our members in places they don't want to be. and frankly i just think that they have lost all credibility. >> we will talk with one of the architects of the deal. house budget committee chair paul ryan. and our power player of the week. molly ringwold on life after being the it girl of the 80s. >> i don't think just being a star or just being famous is
very fulfilling. >> all right now on fox news sunday. and hello again from fox news in washington. well, no matter how many times we see the images it is still agonizing. kids streaming out of school arms raised. this time in colorado a student opened fire in his high school and critically injuring a 17-year-old girl before turning the gun on hills. and it came as newtown, connecticut marks one year since the horrific shooting that took 26 lives at sandy hook elementary. one of the victims that day, vicky soto, a first grade teacher killed trying to protect her students from the shooter. the photo of her sister learning what happened has become our image of that day. we will discuss where the gun debate stands with two people on opposite sides of the issue. first, my interview with vicky's kid sister, carly
soto. carly, how are you and your family doing one year later? >> taking it day by day. we have our bad days. we have our good days. it has been a rollercoaster every year, but most importantly we are tie -- we are trying to deal with our feelings as they come. >> you say you have your good days. what is a good day? >> we just had a new little baby born in our family. that was a good day. but it is also sad because vicky never got to meet ms. madeline victoria. >> named after her. >> named after vicky. the picture of you from that day on your cell phone when you first got the news has become in a sense our image of the heartbreak of that day. as we mark the first anniversary , how do you feel about that? the fact that you have to dredge this up and guys like me are asking you questions about it. >> i can remember everything
from that day. i can remember everything that somebody said to me, every smell, every person. it is so vive said to me. -- vivid to me. >> the fact that it is brought up again, is that hard for you? >> it is very hard. i am just trying to keep myself busy and think of our one-year anniversary as just another day. because every day without vicky is extremely hard. one year later it is just another day to me and it is just another day without my older sister by my side. >> vicky has been honored for her extraordinary courage that day. the fact she literally put herself in front of the rifle to protect her first grade students. a school nearby has been named for her and she received one of the highest awards. have i to think as kid sister all of that doesn't matter. you just miss her. >> i would give back everything to have my older sister back. it is amazing our country has recognized my sister and the
other five educators as heros because i know that my sister would have done anything to save more of her kids. because of my sister 11 of her kids are able to have a future. they are able to grow up and live their lives. >> there was of course national outrage h after newtown, calls from gun control and especially universal background check. i know you were in the senate gallery the day the senate voted that down. how do you explain the fact a year later nothing has happened? >> it was extremely hard to watch these members of congress come in and vote no on something so sensible. it is a background check and it takes 90 seconds. it is not preventing anyone that should not have a gun. it was hard for that to happen and to see it happen, but like president barack obama told me and vice president biden that nobody ever thought slavery would be abolished and nobody
thought women will have rights and i believe we will have sensible gun laws in the future. >> you recently joined the group mayors against illegal guns. i know you have gone out around the country to argue for more gun control. i have to think that is a tough thing for you. i have to think at least part of you would like to get as far away from this as possible. >> it is hard. there is definitely days where i don't want to do this. i don't want to speak on camera. i don't want 20* talk in front of a group of people. but my sister can't do that. there are so many people that can't be advocates for this. i know i can. >> as we mark this first anniversary and as we think back to that -- to the horrible events of that day, what would you like us to remember about vicky, about how she lived and how she died? >> my sister was an amazing person all-around.
she loved teaching and that's all she wanted to do since the age of three. she wanted to be a teacher like her god mom. and she did everything in her power to save those kids. i know that she wouldn't have done anything differently. it is sad i will never be able to have a conversation with my sister, b i am so thankful that she was able to save so many of her kids that were in that -- that were in her classroom that day. it is hard but i am so, so proud to say i am victoria soto's little sister. >> carly, if i may, i just want you to know that we are all -- all of our thoughts and prayers go out to you and to your family and especially in this holiday season and we are just as proud of her as you are. >> thank you very much. >> we want to bring in mark kelly, husband of former congresswoman gabby giffords who was injured in a shooting
almost three years ago. since then they started a group americans for responsible solutions on gun control. captain kelly, you haven't had much success this past year. congress has passed no major new gun legislation and let's take a look at what the record is in the states. they have passed 109 new gun laws, but two-thirds of them loosen restrictions and not tighten them. how do you explain it? >> well, i mean, i think you chalk it up to politics. the influence that certain organizations have on members of congress in washington. so we haven't had much success there in dc. we have had success around the country. now you point out it is two-thirds where it loosens some gun laws, but in places like colorado and delaware they passed expanded background check bills. over time this will have a very positive effect and we have had the recent races in virginia where this issue was
discussed. not only around the state, but during the debates. so we saw some success there as well. >> captain, is it true that you are focusing more now on the mental health side of this and the gun control side, both better treatment and also more effective reporting of people who have mental health problems to the federal background check? >> well, chris, this is a complicated issue. there isn't one reason why we have such a horrendous rate of death from gun violence. it needs to be approached in a bunch of different ways. i still strongly believe that the first thing we should do is require a back ground check before somebody can buy a gun to prevent people who are dangerously mentally ill or criminals. but you know, the mental health aspect of this is significant as well. >> are you also focusing more now on politics and trying to change the map as you put it. you and your wife, the former
congresswoman, have set up a pact to push the issue. it is a super pact and a pact to contribute money to candidates. i guess the question is do you really think that you can beat the gun lobby which in the first six months of the year out spent you 10-1. >> well, i don't know if they out spent us 10-1, but the race in virginia we spent about the same amount of money as the nra did. and you saw the results there. but we don't have to compete i think one to one with any organization. i think all we need to do is bring some balance to the equation because for so long there was really just the gun lobby who was communicating with the con -- constituents of the members of congress and that's not the case anymore. with a little balance we are going to get members of congress to think about their next election and then we will see more change.
>> you say you had success passing laws in colorado and that is only part of the story. after the tougher gun legislation was passed there was a recall election and two top state senate democrats were recalled and forced out of office. >> well, john morris before said you could see it in the state senate. they had a tough district as well. so they knew going in that this could affect their outcome. i truly believe a recall should not be used for somebody not doing their job. that's a mistake. but it did happen. the reality though is the law is still the law of the land. and over time that background check will have a positive effect in the state of colorado. >> captain kelly, you are running a tv ad right now that shows scenes of the grieving after newtown over the melody of silent night.
letsy play a clip of that now. >> captain when you look back over the last year, the national outrage initially over newtown and the lack of action especially at the congressional level, honestly do you ever get discouraged? >> yes, we get a little discouraged, gabby and i do. what happened in april when the bill was not passed, a bill that was supported by 92% of americans and even 74% of nra members supported the background checks. to see that fail, that was not a good day. but we know this is a tough fight. politics is a difficult business. we are in this for the long haul and i am confident that over time we will be successful. >> captain kelly, thank you for coming in and thank you for joining us. >> you're welcome. now for the the other side
of the gun debate, larry pratt is the executive of the gun owners of america. mr. pratt do you see the failure to pass any new major gun legislation on the congressional level and not much on the state level, do you see that as a victory for gun rights? >> well, chris, we are not going to be able to talk about a victory until we get rid of the laws that prohibit people from having guns to protect themselves. every one of our mass murders in our country has occurred in places where guns were prohibited. >> so what you are saying is it is not a victory that you have stopped more gun lags. you want to see the legislation rolled back? >> that is correct. the legislation is on the books and it is lethal. it is killing people. all of these gun free zones are murder magnets. we have simply got to get rid
of them. it is an illusion to think that somehow we are going to be safer because we can't have a gun in a particular area because the bad guy is going to have a gun. >> how do you explain the fact that we have this huge national outrage after newtown and according to the polls 90% of americans including a lot of gun owners supported the idea of expanded background checks and almost nothing happened. >> i would dispute those polls. i don't think 90% agree on anything. from what we were finding, the notion that gun owners were part of the 90% didn't jive with what we found with our members and what the nra found with their members. gun owners of america doesn't put creedence in those polls. the fact that i don't think the congress did either. they weren't hearing that from their constituents. >> let's talk about the problem now. when you see and we have over
the last year since newtown these continued acts of violence whether it was that shooting on friday in the colorado high school whether it is shootings in workplaces or in other public places and shopping malls, how do we stop it? i want to put what president obama -- he addressed the issue in the weekend media address and here is what he had to say. >> we have to do more to keep dangerous people from getting their hands on a gun so easily. we have to do more to heal troubled minds. >> mr. pratt, how do you answer the president? >> he is looking at it through the wrong end of the telescope. the problem is not how will we keep bad guys from getting guns, they will get guns. the problem is when will we stop the good guys from having guns to be able to protect themselves so when one of these dirt bags goes into a mall or school somebody is able to protect themselves and others by having their own
gun. >> let's take the case of the background check. you would agree people with a history of mental illness shouldn't have guns, correct? >> the idea is not to be able to keep the bad guys from getting guns. they will get guns. the background check is futile. it is something like 42, maybe last year of record were prosecuted for trying to buy a gun with a criminal record out of 11 million. it is not a crime-fighting tool and to rely on the background check is not going to be effective. we have got to be able to protect ourselves and not rely on something like the background check. >> since it first came in they were denied guns because they failed the check. some are able to get guns, but a lot -- a fellow who is not a hardened criminal, wouldn't that be the difference between getting his hands on the gun
and not getting his hands on one? >> if we are really serious about people who have some kind of problem mental or criminal they ought to be in jail. we ought to put them in jail and not just think that somehow saying you can't get a gun, but going down the street we are not going to bother with you, that's silly. that is not a very good idea. >> and finally we have a minute left. we heard mark kelly and we also heard michael bloomburg say that they are going to spend $25 million in this next election cycle trying to elect people who are supporters of more gun control. dodo you think this will be a big issue in the election? >> i am not sure the amount of money that billionaire bloomburg has is going to be effective. he out spent the candidates that won in colorado enormously. and he lost. so i think the message is we don't like the errogance of
power and we don't like the message we should be disarmed as a way of fighting crime. mayor bloomburg's message is wrong and he is going to continue to lose. >> mr. pratt, thank you, thanks for coming in and giving us your side of the debate. >> thank you very much. now to mourning on the other side of the globe. south africans said goodbye to former president nelson mandela. laid to rest in his rural home village. several thousand guest usa tended the funeral of the man who helped reconcile his country at the end of apartheid. up next, a compromise in coming over the budget. one of the authors answers conservative cribbing particulars next. critics next.
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but there was actually a spirit of compromise on scape toll hill this week. -- on capitol hill this week. the house passed a bipartisan budget agreement which the senate is expected to approve next week. for all of the good cheer, there was plenty of criticism. especially from the right. earlier i spoke with house budget chair paul ryan. his senate counterpart, patty murray declined our invitation. congressman, welcome back to fox news sunday. >> good to be back. >> your budget deal has opened an even bigger split inside the republican party between the house republican leaders who supported the compromise and outside tea party groups who opposed it. some before it was announced. here was house speaker boehner
this week. >> the day before the government reopened, one of the people -- one of these groups stood up and said well we never thought it would work. are you kidding me? >> are you getting fed up with these outside groups who talk tough from the sidelines? >> look, i think john got his irish up there. i think these groups are available. the way i look at it is this, they are part of our conservative family. i would prefer to keep these conversations within our family. john was frustrated because they came out against our agreement before we even reached an agreement. i was frustrated with that as well. i see the tea party as indispensable. it is inavailable with keeping the -- invaluable with keeping the taxpayer in the game. keep washington accountable. they helped us get our ship righted again by being fiscally conservative. i think what we are doing today, we have two-thirds of the house conservatives voting for this. this is a step in the right direction. it is not as far as i want to go, but a step in the right direction. >> are you also taking heat
from some fellow republicans in congress including and one might say potentially rivals for the 2016 presidential nomination. >> it raises it, but pays it over 10 years. you know how that works. they will forget it and keep borrowing more. >> what do you say? >> i would love to talk to him about it. marco is a good friend of mine. i disagree with him respectfully. we are making permanent law changes and those savings uh -- accrue and compound. not only are we doing auto pilot saving, we are paying for $63 billion of sequester relief. half going to defense. we are maintaining 92% of the sequester in this deal and we are preventing two government shutdowns from possibly occurring next year. >> let's look at the deal. i want to put up numbers on the screen, some of which you just mentioned. you bust the caps and increase
spending by $62 billion over the next two years. >> can i get you right there for a second? >> let me finish. we do all of the math. i will probably make several mistakes. you reduced deficits by $85 billion over the next 10 years for a net deficit reduction of $23 billion. the biggest complaint is that you are trading definite spending increases right now in return for the promise of deficit reduction during hillary clinton's second>> let'r happens. here is my issue. we are not busting sequester caps. in this the next two years 70% of the sequester is in tact. >> but $60 billion more -- 92% of the sequester is in tact. the democrats said get rid of the sequester. we got them to agree to 70% now and 92% exists over the term of the deal. .1 and .2. as i mentioned before changing entitlements and changing what we call mandatory spending is
the auto pilot part of the government. we are permanently asking the federal workers to contribute more to their pensions so the hard-working taxpayers who pay for the pensions don't have to pay as much. that's not a permanent law change. that's not something that is a promise and might happen later. it is happening now. the savings accumulate. if god forbid we have a hillary clinton second term, we would have to change a new law. we are doing permanent law. that's the point i am trying to make. look at the details of those who are criticizing it. it is keeping our principal in tact. no tax increases, net deficit and spending approach. >> you bust the sequester cuts, you said we don't bust them. but you let them leak. you spend $60 billion more than you would have under the sequester. >> that's right. >> and a sequester, a lot of people feel, has imposed real budget discipline. the critics say you are going
back to the days of spending more and taxing more. there is new revenue. >> there are no taxes in this. there are user fees that said let's have the users pay for the government they use instead of the taxpayer who doesn't use the services. a person gets on the plane and why don't they pay for the security. those are the ceendz of things we are saying here. look, this is divided government, chris. the budget we pass in the house in march is what we want and what we are going for. the balance of the budget that pays off the debt entirely, it is our vision. it is our goal. that's what we ultimately want to go. this doesn't substitute for that. this is a small step in direction for that. i am not trying to over sell this as an enormous budget accomplishment. it is not. it is important that it prevents government shutdowns. it is important that it rejects tax increases. it is important we set a precedence -- the budget control act said 1 for 1. this goes beyond that. >> i want to talk to you about the shutdown.
you say and quite rightly so and it is a big accomplish meant, you remove the threat of government shutdowns for almost the next two years. on the other hand we have a debt limit crisis which is going to come up in the next couple months. february and march the people are saying. should republicans risk a default crisis? as you know the president said are you going to send the country that default by de -- by demanding? or do you cave there and say look, we are going to kick this can down the road and focus on obamacare? >> one step at a time, chris. patty and i knew we were not going solve. >> patty murray. >> sorry, patty murray and i knew we would not solve every problem like the debt problem, but we wept out to solve this problem. this is a shutdown pass blee in january and possibly again in october. we wee have our principals established here. >> i understand that, but the question is will you demand more in return for raising the
deficit. >> we will meet and discuss what it is we want to get out of the debt limit. we don't want anything out of the debt limit. we will decide what it is we can accomplish by one of the problems or concerns i have is we don't know when it is going to hit. the treasury secretary has ultimate discretion on when this could occur. the timing is very much in doubt. we are going to meet in our retreats after the holidays and discuss exactly what it is we are going to try and get with this. >> in the bill that the house passed, the republicans extend the so-called dock fix. you avoid a major cut in reimbursement to doctors who treat medicare patients. you extend that for three months. so the other hand you do nothing to extend unemployment benefits for the 1.3 million americans who will lose it after christmas. that shows just exactly what is wrong with republican priorities. they care more about doctors than the unemployed. >> this was brought to the
package with pay force meaning spending cuts to pay for the doc fix. they asked for unemployment extension and they asked for nothing to pay for it which would have blown a hole in our deficit. a 13th extension of this emergency unemployment extension from the twee crisis -- from the 2008 crisis, we have evidence showing it would prolong unemployment. we want jobs. we want pro growth policies that help create jobs so we don't have people going on unemployment in the first place. one of the things we think it will accomplish by providing the government shutdowns is you can get the economy growing again. our focus is on job creation and not the extension of an emergency benefit hat was started in 2008. >> 30 seconds left. you and patty murray sat down and arrived at this deal, but it is no grand bargain. you come away in 30 seconds thinking a grand bargain is impossible or it is on basic principals, tax revenue
increases? >> chris, i don't think with this president or with this senate we will have something like that. that's why i think we need to win a couple of elections. this i believe helps us better do that. it is good for the country and it allows us to focus on our obamacare oversight and laying out our conservative vision in 2014. we will have to win the senate and we will have to win the white house to fix this country's fiscal problems. i don't think this senate is willing to do it. >> congressman ryan, thank you for coming in today and merry christmas to you. >> merry christmas. our sunday panel comes around next to discuss the pros and cons of this not so grand bargain on the budget. and later, the continuing problems with obamacare. plus, what would you like to ask the panel? just go to tweeter at fox -- twitter at fox news sunday. we may ask your question on the air.
that need to be made now. >> house speaker boehner talking about the budget deal that passed the house this week. it is time now for our sunday group. fox news political analyst brett hume and julie pace who covers the white house for the associated press, bill cristo of the weekly standard and bob woodward from the "washington post." we talked with paul ryan and speaker boehner seemed to go out of his way to hammer these groups that from the outside oppose the budget deal. he says those groups are using his republican members to build their organizations and raise money. what has gone on here? >> there is a war within the republican party. there is a certain set of outside groups which have opposed so many things that the republicans have tried to do and actually pass and who are satisfied with nothing is
that you could ever get through the house or the senate. there is enough with money in their pockets who will keep these groups flush as long as they keep up their opposition. it has, woulded well for them and they have had -- it has worked for them. >> it is good for him to take them on? >> it may em bolden his caucus to some extent. he was not strong enough to do that during the round of negotiations that lead to the shutdown. he let them have their way. they tried this de fund strategy and it lead to the shutdown. he feared it would be unpopular as it did and they would get nothing out of it which is exactly what happened. i think a lot of his members learned the lesson and now he is willing to take them on. look what is happening in the senate. mitch mcconnell, the leader there who is less sympathetic to these groups than boehner is, is not going to vote for this budget deal because he has a primary challenger and that's what they worry about and that's where they have this effect.
>> let's talk about the other end of pennsylvania avenue. the white house is pushing the narrative this weekend that between the bipartisan budget deal and something of a staff shake up, i am not sure it is really a shake up. it is moving around the deck chairs. they can jump start the president's second term agenda including on immigration reform. julie is our woman at the white house. do they really believe that? >> the narrative they are pushing publicly is stronger than what they believe privately. when they look at the budget deal they are pleased with it. but for one real purpose and that is because it takes the threat of a shutdown off the table. then they look at the next year and they say they can all sit around and stair at each other. they are certainly going to try it again. i don't know if this budget deal changes the dynamic that exists in washington around immigration or minimum wage and early childhood education. what is the other option? they can either try it or they
can't. >> we are asking all of you to send us questions on twitter or facebook and we got this one on twitter from dave jj about the budget deal. why are gop for this? it does nothing to stop the bleeding now? bill, how do you answer dave. i can remember paul ryan talking over and over about we have to deal with the main drivers of the debt entitlements. this doesn't do that. >> president obama won't do it and harry reid won't do it. it is a good short-term deal. it gets the money for defense which is much needed and it doesn't give away anything. it is discretionary spending and it is not the big deal. there is not going to be a big deal. paul ryan accomplished something important. you mentioned the war and the outside groups. we will look back in two months and say that was the last shot of the wharf 2013. he is getting the irish up and hitting out of the groups.
what rine -- what ryan has done is cleared the decks. there won't be a circular firing squad over a government shutdown. as long as they can handle the debt ceiling which is a question, but that is manageable. the republican party could be united going forward next year in focusing on obamacare. they have accomplished a political matter and as a substantive matter if you care about defense spending it is impressive. >> we will talk about the debt ceiling in a moment, but i want to pick up on your point that barack obama won't do anything about entitlements. having read your book "the price of politics" in the book president obama said democrats have to get serious about entitlements. i think he used the word untennable. it seems as if congressional democrats decide they want to hold that man tell as the protector of entitlements going into 2014 jie. and i think this budget deal worked quite frankly. let's go to the center of this.
obama was not part of the negotiations. he is not a good negotiator. i agree with phil. paul ryan comes off as somebody who no one, even bill, is not going to say ryan is a conservative. he is a conservative, but the philosophy that he employed here is very significant. sitting down with the democrats and saying what is our common ground? what can we agree on? it is indeed small, but it is a step forward and what it does is it strengthens ryan, but it also strengthens boehner in a very, very significant way. he got way over 300 votes for this and he said -- he castigated the ultra right wing and outsiders and i think he is in a position that maybe they can deal on some of these things. >> let's pick up with this question of the debt ceiling. before we say it is all great
here the fact that there won't be a government shutdown, but come february or march they will have to deal with the debt ceiling. we will have reached that limit again. you just heard paul ryan say we are not -- not going to ask for something -- basically he said he are going to demand something for. it the president's position in october was no deal, no negotiating. is he going to hold to that? >> i think he will hold to that. you can see the sides lining up much as they did earlier this year where the republicans say we have to get something in order to lift the debt ceiling. the president is saying, we won't give you anything. i think there are always ways on the hill where you can work things out so that both sides can claim they got that position. the real question about this budget deal will be whether it does change some of the approaches from some of the real conservatives when it comes to the debt ceiling. do they say, okay, we can let this go forward? bill would know better than i do. >> what has changed in the attitudes of the administration? what is it president obama held out for that he wouldn't give in for? no delay of obamacare.
how does that look now? maybe they should delay obamacare and do a favor to tens of millions of americans as the debt ceiling deal? >> with all of the conservative criticism of this mini deal on the budget, can they really raise the debt ceiling without getting something in return? >> i don't think so. one of the reasons is they stand on firmer political ground in resisting the debt limit increase without getting something for it. shutting down the government over the budget is unpopular, was unpopular and will be unpopular if it happens again. making a big fight on the debt limit, the increase of which is very unpopular. it has them on stronger political ground. i still say if the government shuts down it will not work for the republicans. >> we have to take a break, but when we come back x more deadline changes for owe bay you ma care. where does that leave the health care overhaul? our panel has some answers.
i think that the statement about keeping your plan was one that is applicable to the vast majority of americans in the health insurance market. >> health and human services secretary kathleen sebelius is continuing to argue that the president didn't mislead the country even though an independent fact checking group calls his claim. if you would like your plan you can keep your plan. the lie of the year. and we are back now with the panel. well, as the healthcare.gov website improves the white house is putting more focus on when people are going to actually start getting their
new plans on january 1st. but they have made some changes. let's put these up on the screen. they are now requiring insurers to cover people wht don't pay their premiums until december 31st, the day before the new year, and they are, quote, encouraging companies to cover people retroactively after the deadline and to also let them see their old doctors even if those doctors are no longer in the network. julie, this january 2nd when people have to go to doctors and don't know which doctor and don't know whether they have actually got insurance could be the next mess for obamacare. >> january makes a lot of people in the white house nervous. we know what the problems have been with the website, but people who have actually gotten through and think they have cog will then -- have coverage will go and try to use the coverage. if they can't use the coverage there will be a whole host of problems on the political spectrum and policy side. what is interesting about these changes that the white house announced on thursday is that they are intended to make this easier for people, but when you talk to these insurance companies they say
it is actually quite confusing. some are optional, some are mandatory. you have states running their own systems. i think we are going to have to see whether the intention of this is going to be carried out. >> we are also learning, and not surprisingly, that some insurers are finding a way around the requirement that they must accept all customers regardless of their physical condition. whether they have a preexisting condition. for instance those with serious diseases, they say well, the pill you must take to stay alive or alleviate your condition, that won't be covered. they found a loophole. >> that's what insurance companies do. they try to make their risk pools as narrowly drawn as possible so they can avoid having to pay out the benefits. that's what they do. and the law was written in such a way that apparently there are opportunities for them to do that. it is how insurance works. if you have too much risk and you pool, you don't make money and you don't do business and you go down.
i question how terribly widespread this is, but i have no doubt it happened. i think the problem though is the insurance companies could be blamed for this and the administration will no doubt and its defenders no doubt try to do that. the problem is the obamacare rollout and much of the policy itself and the eke tent people have -- extent people are feeling it is such a disaster that the law and the policy gets the blame when anything goes wrong whether it is the insurance company's fault or the law's fault. >> bob, i will pick up. i think the general feeling is that the website is finally getting better, but you see all of these problems cropping up. i can just imagine people on january 2nd. i imagine they are watching bowl games on january 1st, but january 2nd going to a doctor and not having an insurance card and not knowing if they are covered or not and not knowing if they can see their old doctor instead of their new doctor because they don't know about the insurance -- this could be a real mess. >> it already is a real mess.
i don't know how you untangle it. if you think strategically in the white house as they try to do, they have got to get a new subject here. and, you know, whether the details of this are always always going to be visited upon them, to a certain extent they can't get out from under this and, you know, in my newspaper this morning there's an opinion piece about the person who had the worst year in washington is obama, and there's a certain truth to that. but the white house needs to find a way to start talking about things, and a lot of these are negatives but we haven't had a big terrorist attack. we don't have a new war, as lots of people would like to have. it's good we don't have that. the economy, though struggling, is advancing, so the white house has got to find some way to get out from under this, and it may literally be impossible because
the president and his team in the white house appointed themselves mission managers for obamacare. >> you know, bill, and i want to pick up on this kind of macro. look at all this, because you have spent, you and others have spent your career making the conservative argument and saying that big government isn't the way to go to solutions. is it possible that barack obama could be a more effective spokesman and could do more to help the conservative cause than any of you on the right ever have? >> sure. socialism in eastern europe didn't want to make the case against conservatism and i think the same will be true of obama's administration and especially obamacare. republicans have to not let people forget who is responsible for this, but also i think do try to propose ways to let people escape from the nightmare of obamacare, and there are ways to do so. the republicans tried to do this
in november with their bill that would have allowed insurance companies to keep offering the same insurance they did last year. people can buy temporary health insurance right now. it's not covered by obamacare. there's a penalty. they should waive the penalty and let the states extend that temporary houealth insurance to let people he is kescape the pr. >> but there's no way you can get a new bill now. i mean -- >> i don't nwhy not? >> the idea that somebody -- >> for one year -- >> good luck. >> i will say though that to get to the sort of larger point, inside the white house there is the immediate short-term conversation about how to fix obamacare, but there is this broader conversation happening about the hit they are taking on the general philosophy of government that barack obama and democrats have been proposing for years, and when you have
people who are running for re-election in 2014 and then democrats who are running for the presidency in 2016, how much of this debate about the role of government is infused in that election? >> are they really talking about this is really hurting the whole philosophy about government can help solve things? >> absolutely. this is a conversation that they are having. like i said, there's two fold conversation, the short-term -- >> how do they change that? >> they make the law work. that's really the only way to convince people that, yes, in fact, government can run a large operation like this. >> but, you know, you talked about a bill sailing through, brit. i can't imagine republicans want to let barack obama off the hook. >> i would disagree with that. i would think the kind of fix bill described were proposed, republicans would support it in droves. >> thank you, panel. see you next week. undoubtedly to be continued. up next, our power player of the week, hollywood's every girl of the '80s.
felt some sort of affinity for, and i guess every boy kind of wanted to date. >> back in the '80s molly ringwald was called the patron sa saint of adolescence. the star of "six teen candles," the breakfast club and pretty in pink. she was such an icon for generation "x," she made the cover of "time" magazine. >> make a wish. >> it already came true. >> why do you think you, molly ringwald, struck such a chord with folks? >> there's just something about my face i think that people have always kind of responded to. i can make people cry. my husband says that's my super power. i make people cry. ♪ baby you're mine on a platter ♪ ♪ i always get my man >> ringwald is now 45 and touring as a jazz singer, and a
turns out the rest of her life has been just as interesting as those heady days a quarter century ago. you were never really comfortable being just a star. >> well, i don't really think that just being a star, just being famous is very fulfilling. >> by the late 1980s, she was turning down pop roles for serious movies, and in 1992 she moved to paris. she says it was all about trying new things. >> i really am more interested in looking forward. if i look back, it really -- i guess it's the same way people look back on their baby pictures. ♪ don't you forget about me >> in addition to singing and acting, ringwald has written two books, and, yes, america's teen sweetheart is now the mother of three with a 10-year-old daughter and 4-year-old twins. she recently watched "pretty in
pink" with her oldest child. >> it was the first time i really had the feeling that i was seeing them like everyone else through my daughter's eyes. >> and? >> it was great. it was great. >> why didn't ringwald become a train wreck like so many teen stars? >> i think, you know, lindsay lohan is obviously a troubled individual. i was really fortunate in that i had a really great family, and i feel sad for people that are in the business that don't have that. >> and so molly ringwald is going to keep doing it all and not looking back much. >> i'm just really looking forward to this, you know, to the next act. i think that it will involve music and writing and directing and acting. >> ringwald has released her first album called "except sometimes." she's donating a portion of the sales to the end of the year could a charity called l.a. kitchen. that's it for today. have a great week and we'll see
you next "fox news sunday." fox news sunday is a presentation of fox news. this week on "the journal editorial report," the white house releases new obamacare enrollment numbers but not the one that is really matter. if the law is finally working, why the secrecy? plus, a bipartisan budget accord averts another government shutdown but angers some conservatives. was it the best deal republicans could get? if you thought the irs targeting scandal was over, think again. we'll tell you about the agency's latest efforts to silence tea party groups. welcome to "the journal eder to yol report." i'm paul gigot. the white house released new obamacare enrollment